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Subject: [rec.music.celtic] - FAQ

This article was archived around: 10 Mar 1998 16:11:19 +0000

All FAQs in Directory: music/celtic
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Archive-name: music/celtic/faq Last Modified: Thu Jun 26 1997 Version: 2.00 Posting-Frequency: weekly (rec.music.celtic), monthly (rec.answers,news.answers)
FREQUENTLY ASKED QUESTIONS : REC.MUSIC.CELTIC ============================================= (comments and suggestions: graham@collins-peak.co.uk) This document attempts to answer the questions which are asked on a weekly basis in the REC.MUSIC.CELTIC newsgroup. Please read this before posting a query into the group, as your question may already have been answered. It will be posted every Monday to rec.music.celtic. If you have WWW access then an extended version of the FAQ is available from: http://www.collins-peak.co.uk/rmc/ Contents ======== 1.0 Introduction 1.1 What is REC.MUSIC.CELTIC (R.M.C.)? 1.2 What is the difference between REC.MUSIC.CELTIC and REC.MUSIC.FOLK? 1.3 How is "Celtic" pronounced? 1.4 How is "Gaelic" pronounced? 2.0 Getting advice 2.1 I like X, what other bands would you recommend? 2.2 I have X, Y and Z from band W. What other albums should I buy? 2.3 I love instrument X - which bands use it, and on which albums? 2.4 How do I get information/recordings/other about/by band X? 3.0 On-line Information 3.1 WWW Starting points 3.2 Mailing lists 4.0 Ordering recordings 4.1 Mail order/phone 4.2 On the Internet 4.3 General advice on mail order 5.0 Favourite questions 5.1 Is Enya related to Clannad? 5.2 Which part of Ireland are Capercaillie from, and which part of Scotland are Altan from? 5.3 Is Enya dead? 5.4 When is the Clan Alba album coming out? 5.5 Is there a translation of &lt;song name&gt; by Clannad? 5.6 Who wrote <song name> and where can I find it? 5.7 Which song should I have played at my wedding? 5.8 Would anyone like to swap tapes with me? 6.0 Celtic Music radio shows 6.1 UK 6.2 USA & Canada 6.3 Ireland 6.4 Elsewhere 7.0 Acknowledgements ================================================================= 1.0 Introduction 1.1 What is REC.MUSIC.CELTIC (R.M.C.)? The REC.MUSIC.CELTIC charter states: REC.MUSIC.CELTIC is an unmoderated forum for the discussion of all issues relating to Celtic music. Generally understood, "Celtic music" refers to the folk musics of Ireland, Scotland, Wales, Brittany, (Spanish) Galicia, Cornwall, the Isle of Man, and certain parts of Canada (esp.Newfoundland/Cape Breton), as well as more recent musical styles (i.e. rock, jazz, new age) that draw heavily from these folk traditions. It should be understood, though, that not all musicians who hail from Ireland/Scotland/ Wales/Brittany/etc. necessarily play Celtic music. Celtic music is not defined by the passport, ancestry, or place of origin of the musicans, but by the sound and the feel of the music itself. Welcome topics on rec.music. celtic include (but are by no means limited to), the discussion of artists, songs, and recordings; the discussion of instruments frequently used in Celtic music; the discussion of festivals and concerts of Celtic music; the discussion of bars, pubs, and nightclubs that regularly feature Celtic music; the discussion of stores and record companies that specialize in Celtic music; and musicological discussion of the history, the influences, and the characteristics of Celtic music. Although it is not, strictly speaking, "Celtic" the traditional music of England is also a welcome topic of discussion in rec.music.celtic, due to the great overlap (in terms of both musical history and audience interest) between it and other forms of Celtic music. 1.2 What is the difference between REC.MUSIC.CELTIC and REC.MUSIC.FOLK? REC.MUSIC.CELTIC is a place for the discussion of both traditional and modern forms of Celtic music, so as to enable the discussion of Celtic folk music, Celtic rock, and Celtic new-age, in the same group. The instigator (Jim Chokey) and a number other posters thought there should be a place where one could talk about The Clancy Brothers, Clannad, Enya, Alan Stivell, Boiled in Lead, the Pogues, Patrick Ball, Mary Black, Runrig, etc., all in one place. Rec.music.folk was a fine place to talk about the traditional Celtic music, but the more rockish stuff and the more new-agey stuff wasn't really welcome there. The purpose of rec.music.celtic to create a group where *all* forms of Celtic and Celtic-influenced music could be discussed. That's why it's called rec.music.celtic and not rec.music.folk.celtic. 1.3 How is "Celtic" pronounced? If you are talking about the newsgroup, the people, the language, art, culture, etc, then it is with a hard C (as in K - Keltic). The only exception is a soccer team in Glasgow, and a basketball team in Boston who pronounce it with a soft C (Seltic), because they were/are mainly referred to by English speakers. The Celtic languages (Gaelic, Welsh, Manx, Cornish and Breton) have no soft C (they use S instead), and so would not pronounce "Celtic" in that way. 1.4 How is "Gaelic" pronounced? In Ireland, as "Gaylic" (I'm useless with phonetic spellings, and so are most of the people who read this group), but in Scotland as "Gallic". The languages are similar, and come from a common source, but 1200 years apart has modified things a little....(although it is still possible to understand one if you know the other, given a little effort). 2.0 Getting advice 2.1 I like X, what other bands would you recommend? Questions like this appear on a regular basis. While it is one way to broaden your collection and your tastes, you may find that several other people have asked similar questions in the recent past. It is generally better to listen to live music, or to listen to other people's recordings than to take advice and buy something you have never heard. Radio shows are also a good bet, as you can sample all sorts of bands without having to pay for it. If you are willing to pay hard cash on a whim, you may also like to buy an album which is talked about on the group without hearing it, on the basis that if everyone likes it then it can't be too bad. See also 3.1 2.2 I have X, Y and Z from band W. What other albums should I buy? Again, it is better to listen to someone else's copy and then decide. If you can't do that, then you are in the same position as everyone else when a new release hits the streets - if you like the band, buy it and see... This applies equally well to older recordings. See also 3.1, where ratings and reviews of albums by fans can be obtained. 2.3 I love instrument X - which bands use it, and on which albums? Again, it depends on several factors - the version of an instrument (gut strung harp or metal strung, wooden flute or silver, etc.), how it is played, the accompaniment (if you love the flute and buy a recording because someone plays flute on it only to discover that it can't be heard for a piper......you won't be too happy), etc. See also 3.1, and 3.13 for mailing lists dealing with one particular instrument. 2.4 How do I get information/recordings/other about/by band X? If you have WWW access then almost every band has either an official WWW page, and unofficial WWW page (maintained by a fan of the band) or a page at a record company site. These sites often have the most up to date information available and should be the first place you look for information. The best way to find the page is to use one of the search engines on the net. These let you type in some words and then search the whole of the internet. A few to try are: Lycos - http://www.lycos.com/ Alta Vista - http://www.altavista.digital.com/ Excite - http://www.excite.com/ If that fails you can try looking in the extended WWW FAQ under the list of artists or try any of the sites listed in section 3.1 It is also worth searching previous articles on newsgroups by using Deja News: http://www.dejanews.com/ If you don't have WWW access then some mailing lists and newsgroups dealing with specific artists are listed in section 3.2 3.0 On-line Information Many more links are given on the FAQ WWW page: http://www.collins-peak.co.uk/rmc/ 3.1 WWW starting points These are few good starting points for looking at celtic music on the internet. They provide up to date links to many different sites. Most celtic sites will be linked to from one of these. Suggestions for other up to date starting points are always welcome. Ceolas : http://celtic.stanford.edu/ceolas.html Provides informations and links to information on virtually everything to do with celtic music. Every celtic thing : http://celt.net/og/ A huge list of celtic related site. soc.culture.scottish : http://www.scot.demon.co.uk/scotfaq.html Lot of info on traditional Scots music and also Gaelic songs in it, as well as some lyrics. Celtic Peak : http://www.collins-peak.co.uk/celtic/ A site with a bias towards modern scottish music including links to artists and the WWW sites for some record companies. Dirty Linen : http://www.dirtynelson.com/linen/ Folk Roots : http://www.cityscape.co.uk/froots/ Two of the magazines with celtic content. Lots of links to other sites. 3.2 Mailing Lists These are automatic mail systems which allow a basic discussion on specialised subjects. You are advised to subscribe and read a list for a while before you post to it, to get the feel of its contents and style. (Note if it's a listserv then just mail the command SUB list_name your_name, otherwise you send a message to the contact) Irish Traditional Music Mailing list on Irish traditional music, oriented towards players and traditional, as opposed to popular, music. Membership is about 250, with an average of about half a dozen messages a day. A digest form of the list, with summaries of the most important messages, comes out every month. Subscription address: listserv@irlearn.ucd.ie List address: irtrad-l@irlearn.ucd.ie List address: irtrad-d@irlearn.ucd.ie (digest) Maintainer: Paul McGettrick (ARAR6013@iruccvax.ucc.ie) * Some people have been having problems with the addresses for this list. Let me know of any updates - Graham Folk Music radio shows This is primarily for hosts of folk/bluegrass/celtic radio shows, but all are welcome to join. Runs about 5-10 messages per day usually, includes playlists, band information, Folk Alliance news and chat. Very much US-based. Subscription address: listserv@psuvm.psu.edu. List address: folkdj-l@psuvm.psu.edu Maintainer: Tina Hay, tmh1@psuvm.psu.edu (if you are on Bitnet, use the addresses listserv@psuvm and folkdj@psuvm) Accordion Covers all kinds of accordions and concertina. 10-15 messages a week, discusses contemporary accordion music of all sorts, instrument building and repair. The archive has lots of information on magazines, builders, tutors and tips. ***** NOTE: This is now supplanted by the newsgroup ***** REC.MUSIC.MAKERS.SQUEEZEBOX WWW Archive: http://www.cs.cmu.edu:8001/afs/cs/user/phoebe/mosaic/accordion.html Bagpipes Discusses all kinds of bagpipes, including Scottish, Irish (uileann), Northumbrian, Spanish, Macedonian, Swedish and others. Covers technical issues and news mainly of interest to players. Subscription address: pipes-request@sunapee.dartmouth.edu List address: bagpipe@cs.dartmouth.edu Maintainer: wbc@quimby.dartmouth.edu <Wayne Cripps> Archives and FAQ are available by FTP or Gopher at cs.dartmouth.edu in the directory /pub/bagpipes * Some people have been having problems with the addresses for this list. Let me know of any updates - Graham Harp Subscription address: harp-request@mit.edu List address: harp@mit.edu WWW Archive: file://tns-www.lcs.mit.edu/pub/mail-archive/harp/harp_archive.html Boiled In Lead Subscription address: leadheads-request@asylum.sf.ca.us Maintainer: John Romkey FTP archive: asylum.sf.ca.us /pub/leadheads Oyster Band Subscription address: majordomo@shell1.best.com Send a message which contains subscribe oysters &lt;your-email-address&gt; Wolfstone Contact: wolfstone-owner@mystery.com Subscription Address: Majordomo@mystery.com with the message: subscribe wolfstone Celtic language mailing lists: In general, this area is covered by the SOC.CULTURE.CELTIC newsgroup, which has its own FAQ. Postings on these subjects are probably best sent there, but given the volume of traffic on translation of Gaelic lyrics, these have been included for completeness. Irish Emigrant (News from Ireland) list: Subscribe: ferrie@iol.ie Now a commercial company, but may still be free to academic sites Celtic Linguist list: celtling@MIT.EDU Contact: Andrew H Carnie &lt;carnie@MIT.EDU&gt; Subscribe: via above Irish Studies list: irish-studies@CC.SWARTHMORE.EDU Contact: Michael Durkan &lt;mdurkan1@CC.SWARTHMORE.EDU&gt; Subscribe: Listserv@CC.SWARTHMORE.EDU Ireland (Mostly politics) list: ireland@RUTVM1.RUTGERS.EDU Subscribe: Listserv@RUTVM1.RUTGERS.EDU Irl-News (News and articles) list: Irl-News@RUTVM1.RUTGERS.EDU Subscribe: Listserv@RUTVM1.RUTGERS.EDU Gaelic-M (Same as Gaelic-L except for MIME support) Contact: Email me if interested kelley@ede.sanders.lockheed.com Gaelic-L List: gaelic-l@listserv.hea.ie Language(s): Celtic, Goidelic; PB1201-PB1847 Irish, Scottish, & Manx Gaelic (GAELIC-L) (not restricted to linguistics; also for learners; contributions in a Gaelic language preferred) Listserver: listserv@listserv.hea.ie to send subscription and unsub commands etc For questions, contact: mgunn@irlearn.ucd.ie (Marion Gunn) caoimhin@smo.uhi.ac.uk (Caoimhi/n O/ Donnai/le) craig@scot.demon.co.uk (Craig Cockburn) There's also at that address gaeilge-b@listserv.hea.ie for learning Irish Gaelic and gaidhlib-b@listserv.hea.ie for learning Scots Gaelic NOTE: All the lists at irlearn.ucd.ie have been removed. Contact me is this is incorrect. 4.0 Ordering recordings 4.1 Mail order/phone There is a comprehensive list of mail-order vendors held in text form at the Ceolas Celtic Music archives at Stanford University: http://celtic.stanford.edu/mail-order/ Note that this includes several UK companies who may be able to obtain recordings which are unavailable in the US or Canada - in particular, Celtic Music and Tower Records are worth a try, but this implies no endorsement of their services or pricing. Be warned that UK prices of CDs are higher than in the US - usually 10+ pounds, or around $15-17 before postage. 4.2 On the Internet The Compact Disc Connection has a catalog of 80,000 CDs, including some popular celtic ones. Prices are usually lower than in the shops, and many listings have song titles and short reviews. They do ship to non-US locations for a reasonable price, but for import CDs refer users to Compact Disc Europe. http://www.cdconnection.com/ Compact Disc Europe claims to have the world's largest online CD catalog, with over 100,000 titles. Telnet to CDEUROPE.COM http://www.cdeurope.com/ Music Boulevard has a huge catalogue of CD's including some popular celtic ones (such as the Green Linnet catalogue). It also has various charts, reviews, samples and articles. http://www.musicblvd.com/ would be interested in hearing feedback about these and other online ordering services. 4.3 General advice on mail order When ordering from foreign countries, it is generally best to pay by credit card. Although some may take International Money Orders, this involves getting the IMO to them, with a letter explaining what you want. In addition, many credit card companies will insure your purchase automatically (useful if your dog eats the rare vinyl which took 3 weeks to arrive...). Think VERY carefully before sending cash. As well as being unwise, it is also ILLEGAL in some countries (yes, I'm serious!). Also watch out for the handling charge and commission when paying foreign bills by credit card. If in doubt, check before paying, as this can be non-trivial. Specify your order in detail - if you want the most recent release of an album at $15 rather than one of the last four of the original release at $200, you'd better make it clear before telling them to charge it to your credit card....[;-)] The best way is to give full details of the label and catalogue number (see 3.1 for help in getting them). Finally, some common sense - if you only want one record, get together with some friends and order a lot, then share the postage costs. Apart from anything else, this may get you a bulk discount in some stores. 5.0 Favourite questions 5.1 Is Enya related to Clannad? Yes - she is the sister of Maire Brennan, who is the sister of Pol Brennan, etc. The whole band are related to each other in diverse and Irish ways. After leaving school she joined Clannad in 1980 and, credited under her real name, provided keyboards and (mostly) backing vocals. She appears on their 1982 album Fuaim. It is often said that she also appeared on their 1980 album Crann Ull although she is not listed in the credits. If so then her presence is not obvious from listening to the album. See 3.13. 5.2 Which part of Ireland are Capercaillie from, and which part of Scotland are Altan from? They do sound similar - most people can't tell the difference between traditional Scottish music and traditional Irish music, so they guess... In reality, Altan are Irish and Capercaillie Scottish. The answer to all of these sort of questions is usually &quot;Lots of different places&quot; (step forward Connor MacLeod...). Although they started in one area (Taynuilt near Oban for Capercaillie, and Donegal for Altan - more specifically Gweedore in Donegal. About 10 mins drive from the pub where Enya and Clannad started and which is still owned by their father.), both had various musicians leave/join, so that now they are very mixed. Capercaillie have a famous Irishman in their line-up (Manus Lunny) and are produced by his brother Donal. One of Altan comes from Newcastle, two from Dublin, etc. 5.3 Is Enya dead? No. This rumour has done the rounds several times, and is not funny (it wasn't even funny when it first came round). Please check all facts before posting news to the group, as declaring someone dead when they aren't is anti-social. 5.4 When is the Clan Alba album coming out? After a long wait, the album is available from selected outlets. In the UK, Celtic Music in Harrogate is the sole distributor to my knowledge, and your best bet is to contact them direct: 2-4 High Street Starbeck Harrogate North Yorkshire, England HG2 7HY 5.5 Is there a translation of <song name> by Clannad? Yes (mainly). Most of their Gaelic songs are traditional, and translations of the lyrics can be found on several archive sites. Try Ceolas at http://celtic.stanford.edu/ (See 3.4) or UWP at ftp.uwp.edu (see 3.3). 5.6 Who wrote <song name> and where can I find it? This sort of question is very common, and accounts for much of the repeated traffic on the news group. It can normally be avoided either by reading the sleeve notes on an album which has the song, as the writer will be credited or the track noted as Traditional, or by searching for the song in the Digital Tradition and other online databases (see above). Although most of these databases hold non-copyright material, some songs have been submitted with permission, and at least you will be able to confirm that it isn't traditional. The most common questions will be answered below: a) No Man's Land (Green Fields of France/Willie MacBride) - Eric Bogle 5.7 Which song should I have played at my wedding? This is obviously a very personal thing, but its always best to use something you're familiar with rather than take suggestions from someone else. If you're determined to have something but can't think of a tune or song you really like, Craig Cockburn suggests: 'There are two songs on my homepage below "An cluinn thu mi mo nighean donn" and "Mairi bhan og" which we're using at our wedding - both are Gaelic love songs.' Craig's page can be found at http://www.smo.uhi.ac.uk/~craig/ (http://www.smo.uhi.ac.uk/~craig/songs.html is the songs page, although if you're talking about weddings http://www.smo.uhi.ac.uk/~craig/weddings.html has these songs and more information) 5.8 Would anyone like to swap tapes with me? This has been raised on R.M.C. several times over the past year. It always provokes a massive response, which is split between those who hate to read anything promoting taping, and those who are all for it, and want more in their collection. In most countries, taping of recorded material is a breach of copyright, and is illegal. Taping of live performances is often breach of contract (your ticket is the contract, and may contain clauses about taping). In order to keep the volume of postings in RMC under control, and to prevent a flame-war between normally rational people, it is porposed that subscribers should not post any requests to trade tapes, any offers to sell tapes, or any articles about the morality of taping to the group. This should be treated as off-topic, until a clear majority of the subscribers can decide whether it is valid or not. 6.0 Celtic Music radio shows 6.1 UK Radio Scotland (MW= Medium Wave 810, FM = 92.4 to 94.7) All the programmes below are FM and MW unless otherwise stated Radio Scotland MW can be picked up as far south as London when conditions are favourable. E-mail: radioscotland@scot.bbc.co.uk You can also find out information about Radio Scotland and Radio nan Gaidheal from the BBC WWW page - http://www.bbc.co.uk/ Mon Mr Anderson's fine tunes: 2:00-4:00 Live at the Lemon Tree 7-8pm Tue Mr Anderson's fine tunes: 2:00-4:00 Celtic Connections 7-9pm Wed Mr Anderson's fine tunes: 2:00-4:00 Thu Mr Anderson's fine tunes: 2:00-4:00 Travelling Folk 7-9pm Fri Mr Anderson's fine tunes: 2:00-4:00 Sat Take the floor 6:30-8pm Travelling Folk 8-10pm Celtic Connections 10-12 midnight Sun The Reel Blend: 10-12am MW & FM Pipeline: 9:00-9:45pm Radio nan Gaidheal Radio nan Gaidheal also has a lot of music. Unsure of exact times of music programmes though. (On 103.5 - 105 & 97.9 FM) Na durachdan (6:05-7:30 on Fridays) plays popular request music. The times for some Radio nan Gaidheal broadcasts are: Radio nan Gaidheal an D¨n ╚ideann (Radio nan Gaidheal in Edinburgh) 104.7FM. DiLuain- Diardaoin/ (Mon- Thu): 7:30 - 12:00 & 17:00 - 19:30 (20:00 Diardaoin/Thu); Dihaoine/ (Fri): 7:30 - 12:00 & 17:00 - 23:00 DiSathairne/ (Sat): 9:00 - 13:00 DiDomhnaich/ (Sun): 15:00 - 15:30 & 21:00 - 22:00 Other Moray Firth Radio have a folk show on Thursday evenings 7:30 to 9:00. They can be e-mailed at moray_firth_radio@cali.co.uk Folk on 2, BBC Radio 2. Wednesdays 8-9pm. Covers British Folk. Presented by Jim Lloyd there are also frequent series of folk & features on Wednesdays between 9pm and 9:30pm on Radio 2 On BBC Radio Ulster on Tuesday 10-11 pm british time, there is a program called Folk Box, with Colin Sands. BBC Radio Ulster broadcasts on medium wave, 1341 kHz. It can be heard in south-western Norway, so I presume it may be heard in great parts of the UK and Ireland. 6.2 USA & Canada The Thistle and Shamrock. This is hosted by Fiona Ritchie. There is an on-line list of stations carrying this programme - ftp://celtic.stanford.edu/pub/thistle.list (old information) http://celtic.stanford.edu/pmurphy/thistle.html (much more current) or http://www.cstone.net/~pmurphy/thistle.html The list is maintained by Pat Murphy ( pmurphy@nrao.edu ) and posted regularly to the rec.music.celtic group Ceolas carries another list, of over one hundred American celtic music radio programs, and several in other parts of the world: http://celtic.stanford.edu/pub/radio.list 6.3 Ireland These programmes can be received on the US East Coast... All times are GMT. a. Mora Dhibh - RTE 1, Saturdays 06.37-7.30 MW 567 b. Ceili House - RTE 1, Saturdays 21.15-22.00 MW 567 c. Mo Cheol Thu - RTE 1, Sundays 8.05-8.55 MW 567 d. Both Sides Now - RTE 1 NOW REPLACED BY: Sounds Traditional Mondays 9.15pm - 10.00pm, MW 567 Sounds Traditional Thursdays 9.15pm - 10.00pm, MW 567 6.4 Elsewhere Spain - Asturias M˙sica para raptar princesas. Los 40 principales Asturias Sunday 20:00-21:00 97.5 FM I have no information on other countries. Please send me details if you wish additional entries. 7.0 Acknowledgements Paul Murphy (paul@ousekjar.demon.co.uk) for maintaining the FAQ for several years. Gerard Manning (ceolas@celtic.stanford.edu) for the list of archive sites and mailing lists, plus the on-line ordering information. This document was originally a prettified, tidied and expanded version of an archive sources listing produced by Gerard. Craig Cockburn (craig@scot.demon.co.uk) for answering everyone's questions before the FAQ. Jim Chokey (jchokey@leland.stanford.edu) for getting r.m.c. started.