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Subject: rec.autos.makers.chrysler FAQ, Part 2/6

This article was archived around: Thu, 6 Nov 2014 00:02:16 -0500 (EST)

All FAQs in Directory: autos/chrysler-faq/general
All FAQs posted in: rec.autos.makers.chrysler
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Archive-name: autos/chrysler-faq/general/part2 Posting-Frequency: 100 days Last-modified: 2013/05/22 Version: 5
This section is generally revised every 440 days. IMPORTANT. Do not attempt to respond to faq@allpar.com. **Due to spam this address DOES NOT GO ANYWHERE.** Instead, use the form at http://www.allpar.com/i/form.html Thank you. - - - - - - - - - - - - DISCLAIMER: While every effort has been taken to insure the accuracy of the information contained in this FAQ list compilation, the author and contributors assume no responsibility for errors or omissions, or for damages resulting from the use of the information contained herein. Some of the information is presented as opinion rather than fact. The writers and the maintainer do not claim to be authorities. information below may be reproduced in any way IF credit is given to the writers and maintainer; and that it is not published in book or magazine form without the prior written permission of the maintainer; that the maintainer receives, without asking, a FREE copy of the final material; and that no changes are made (except for formatting) without the express permission of the maintainer (David Zatz of allpar.com). - - - - - - - - - - - - If you did not obtain this FAQ from one of its newsgroups or from the rtfm.mit.edu archives, it is probably NOT current. The latest copy may be obtained from http://www.allpar.com/faq.html - - - - - - - - - - - - PART II *************************CONTENTS***************************** What should I do... 1. ... before I post? 2. ... (removed) 3. ... if I have problems with Chrysler? 4. ... if I own this car? (list of models and what to look for) Oil Filter Discussion List of All Engines Since 1966 1. Guide to V-8s 2. New transmission designations decoded (new!) List of All Body Styles Since 1966 *********************************************************************** BEFORE POSTING WITH COMPLAINTS/QUESTIONS 1. Check the FAQ. Most answers are there. 2. Please don't post messages like "this broke and I will speak to the dealer about it sometime." Go to the dealer first; if they cannot fix it, and it is not in the FAQ, THEN go to the newsgroup. 3. If you are having problems with Chrysler, and have not yet read the relevant FAQ section, please do so. At least call them (800-992-1997). 4. If you are having problems with Chrysler and are angry and bitter at them, an angry message or two is fine. But you won't help anyone by going overboard. Note: this is not just valid for newsgroups but for automotive forums, such as http://www.allpar.com/forums/ *********************************************************************** HOW TO DEAL WITH CHRYSLER CORP. *********************************************************************** (Note: Thanks to Dan Adams for his help with parts of this - Chrysler Corp should be grateful to have him!) * The order in which you should deal with a problem is something like this: 1. Speak politely but assertively with the service writer. 2. Ask to go for a ride with the mechanic and discuss relevant issues wuth them. 3. Service manager. 4. 800 992 1997. 5. Write to Pietro Gorlier at Chrysler in Auburn Hills, MI 6. Zone (voluntary buyback negotiations IF APPLICABLE) 7. Arbitration / Consumer Affairs / Attorney General if applicable AND needed. * Be *polite* and *calm* but assertive at all times. Do not take "no" for an answer but do *not* act angry or make threats. Chrysler often helps, even out of warranty, but they need to be gently pushed; and some Chrysler employees have the strange impression that dealers are wonderful and honest while most customers are liars. The Customer Center reps are often not experts, so elaboration may help. If all else fails, call back and speak to someone else. Always take down their name for your reference! * Know what you're talking about. Check the FAQ, TSBs, your computer codes, and recalls before you visit the dealer with a problem. * Don't expect Chrysler to change something because it's listed in a TSB (technical service bulletin). TSBs describe solutions to problems which may not apply to your car; they are *not* recalls, though Chrysler often fixes cars out of warranty if there is a known problem and TSB on it. * Even if you are in an adversarial relationship, act in a friendly, nonthreatening, non-adversarial manner. It works better and makes both parties less angry. * Daniel Adams writes: Chrysler corporate headquarters does tend to back the field reps but a good service writer can get to them and help you more than you would believe. Don't take your frustration out on the service writers, they carry quite a bit of pull behind the scenes. [And sometimes it helps to know who the good service writers are.] * Don't take "no" for an answer. Call Chrysler at 800-992-1997 from a pay phone if you have to. They will call the dealer. Often, the dealer will discover they don't need to charge you or keep your car after all! * If your dealer keeps fixing the same thing over and over again, get another dealer. Or try the newsgroup. Or write to the CEO of Chrysler. The letter will get to someone in dealer relations or customer service. * If your dealer treats you badly, lies to you, refuses to do the work, etc., get another dealer. * Consider service BEFORE buying the car when you choose a dealer. Also consider asking the salesman who the best service writer is, and only using that service writer. If you always use the same service writer, he will get to know you and you may slowly start to find that you are getting the best mechanics. Also, he will recognize you if you come back often. * It does help to have oil changes and other maintenance done by the dealer, because you will establish a closer relationship with the service writers, and also, soemtimes, because they are more likely to actually use the right parts and fluids. * If you have a continuing problem, speak to the people at the Customer Center. You may need to deal with a zone rep, but we recommend that you write to the Auburn Hills headquarters first. Some reps are good. Others are useless. There have been many reports that the reps in some areas are overly sensitive and defensive. (See message about service writers above -- they can often get action where ordinary mortals cannot). * Note: if your dealer or a subcontractor for your dealer should crash your car (as Continental Auto Body of Wyckoff, New Jersey via Chrysler of Paramus did to my car), immediately ask a lawyer what your options are. Examine the damage personally before they have a chance to cover it up. Do not "take their word for it." In this case restitution may be more than a quick bang-and-repaint. Some shops will do the right thing, but if you have the kind of shop that won't (as I did), it is important that you immediately deal with the situation and do not provide an opportunity for lingering disputes. ****** NON-CHRYSLER SOLUTIONS ****** (after internal solutions fail) courtesy of http://www.acarplace.com/ * Contact your local consumer affairs department. Note: Will not work in states with a predominantly anti-government attitude. 1. File an official lemon law complaint with your state. This will get their attention and help negotiation. You can usually get a better deal through negotiation than in court. Hiring a lemon law specialist may help - good ones will offer to negotiate *first.* Chrysler has a reputation for being easy! 2. Go through the Customer Arbitration Board. Results with this group have been mixed. * Most lawyers don't know the first thing about lemon law! A good one will know the people at the zone office and will try to talk nice to them to solve the problem. If negotiation is not their first move, they are not the right lawyer. * Your chances of getting cash are slim. You will usually get a credit (buy-back). You will not usually get all of your money back. Chrysler follows state laws; most impose a penalty on each mile of use before the first lemon-type complaint. * Go through the latest TSBs again. Something new might have come up. *Whenever your dealer lies to you or is too incompetent, send a letter to Dealer Agreements or the Customer Center (current addresses are on-line and are in your owner's manual if your car is new enough to be under warranty). ************************************************************************ WHAT SHOULD I DO IF I HAVE THE FOLLOWING CAR/ENGINE? ENGINES 2.2/2.5 turbo: -- check for fuel leaks and loose fuel line connections Carbureted V-8/slant six engines -- clean the crankcase inlet air filter regularly. -- keep a spare ballast resistor in your glove compartment -- make sure the stove and damper (vacuum-powered valve) are working -- check/replace vacuum tubes regularly -- make sure float level is adjusted -- on older engines, valves must be manually adjusted from time to time Any engine without DIS (if you have a rotor, this applies to you) --- -- Problems may be caused by low quality rotor or different brand rotor and distributor cap. (Standard-Bluestreak was recommended by Dan Stern. There have been malformed Mopar 2.2/2.5 caps). -- We've seen an aftermarket cap replacement that allows for use of conventional, longer-life wires. 2.7 V6, pre-2006: use synthetic oil to avoid sludge and maintain the PCV system TRANSMISSIONS 4-speed automatic -- all: Change fluid regularly with *recommended* fluid. See http://www.allpar.com/fix/trans.html -- KNOW the right fluid (owner's manual ONLY). Do NOT trust mechanics. -- DO NOT use non-recommended fluid or ANY additives. -- Check for TSBs and have the computer updated if needed. If a dealer doesn't feel/hear it, find another. Persist until they follow the TSB. The new computer save wear and tear on the transmission for various reasons. (1996+ transmissions have software-upgradable computers) -- MOST problems are due to MAINTENANCE ISSUES. Do the maintenance with EXACTLY the fluids and parts recommended! -- DO NOT USE DEXRON III! Do not trust any mechanic! ASK! -- If you have a problem, check the allpar forums and try getting second opinions. Mechanics, including dealership mechanics, are quick to demand that you replace or rebuilt these things even when the problems are minor! Even honest mechanics are jaded by past breakdowns... -- If you DO have a problem, make SURE the first thing they check is the computer error code. Most problems appear to be sensor issues rather than mechanical breakdowns. That's the difference between $100 and $2500! BRAKES -- You may be able to prevent problems with ABS systems by changing the brake fluid every 4 years (or more). -- Often, the ABS light goes on due to dirt in the sensors. Try to troubleshoot it yourself using the engine-code method. http://www.allpar.com/fix/codes.html ******************* CONSUMER REPORTS DISCUSSIONS ******************* Transferred to Web site, http://www.allpar.com/cr.html *********************************************************** From Lloyd Parker, updated since then: **** Engines used in Chryslers since 1966: Lots of info on most of these engines is at http://www.allpar.com/mopar.html * denotes an engine still in production for Chrysler vehicles (some are still used elsewhere, e.g. 2.2 in China, 2.4 in Russia) 4 cylinders 1.4 (MMC) -- Colt, Champ 1.4 (CC/Rover) - BMW Mini 1.5 (Sunbeam) -- Cricket (British) 1.5 (MMC) -- Colt, Summit 1.6 (MMC) -- Colt, Champ, Challenger, Sapporo, Arrow 1.6 (Peugeot) -- Omni, 024, Charger, Horizon, TC3, Turismo 1.6 turbo (MMC) -- Colt 1.6 DOHC (MMC) -- Colt, Summit 1.6 DOHC turbo (MMC) -- Colt 1.6 (CC/Rover) - Mini and export Neons 1.7 (VW) -- Omni, 024, Charger, Horizon, TC3, Turismo 1.8 (MMC) -- Colt, Vista, Summit, Laser, Talon 1.8 (CC) -- Neons outside the US 1.8 (WE)* -- World Engine - Caliber, more (2006+) 2.0 (MMC) -- Arrow, Vista 2.0 DOHC (MMC) -- Laser, Talon 2.0 DOHC turbo (MMC) -- Laser, Talon 2.0 SOHC -- Neon 2.0 DOHC -- Neon, Sebring, Avenger, Talon, Stratus/Cirrus/Breeze 2.0 (WE)* -- World Engine - Caliber, more (2006+) 2.2 -- Omni, 024, Charger, Horizon, TC3, Turismo, Aries, Lancer, Reliant, Shadow, Sundance, 400, 600, Caravelle, Caravan, Voyager, LeBaron, Laser, Daytona, New Yorker, E-Class, Executive, Limousine (note: TBI and carb versions) 2.2 turbo -- LeBaron, New Yorker, Limousine, Laser, Daytona, Lancer, TC, 600, Shadow, Caravelle, Sundance, Omni, Charger, E-Class, Shelby (note: MPI) 2.2 DOHC turbo -- Spirit, Daytona (joint venture with Lotus) 2.2 DOHC turbo -- TC (joint venture with Maserati) 2.2 (Renault) -- Medallion 2.4 (MMC) -- Vista, Summit 2.4 DOHC (CC) -- Cirrus/Stratus/Breeze, 1996+ minivans, PT 2.4 Turbo (CC) - PT GT, SRT-4, Mexican Stratus R/T 2.4 (WE)* -- World Engine - Caliber, Compass, Patriot, more (2006+) 2.5 (CC) -- minivans, Aries, Reliant, Shadow, Sundance, Duster, 600, Lancer, Dynasty, Daytona, Spirit, Acclaim, LeBaron, Caravelle, Dakota (to 1995) - no carb versions 2.5 turbo (CC) -- minivans, Spirit, Acclaim, Shadow, Sundance, LeBaron, Daytona (Note: MPI) 2.5 (AMC) -- Wrangler, Cherokee, Premier, Dakota (96+) 2.6 (MMC) -- New Yorker, E-Class, Executive, Limousine, LeBaron, 400, 600, Aries, Reliant, Caravan, Voyager 2.6 turbo (MMC) -- Conquest (MMC) 2.5 is 2.2 with balance shafts, minor changes. 2.0 (CC) is 2.2 with different heads, fuel system, some tweaks. 3.9 V-6 (below) based on 318. Neon 2.4 is 2.0 with balance shafts, other minor changes. Chrysler families: 2.2/2.5, 2.0/2.4 ---------------------------------- V-6: 2.5 (MMC) -- Sebring, Avenger, Cirrus, Stratus (based on 3.0) 2.7 LH series (1998-2001), Stratus/Sebring 3.0 (MMC) -- LeBaron, TC, minivans, New Yorker, Spirit, Dynasty, Daytona, Stealth, Shadow ES, Acclaim, Duster 3.0 (Renault) -- Premier, Monaco 3.0* "Pentastar" V6 (not used in North America) 3.2 LH series (1998+) 3.2* "Pentastar" V6 (see http://www.pentastars.com/ ) 3.3 New Yorker, Dynasty, LH series, minivans 3.5 LH series (1998+), Prowler (steel and aluminum versions) - Chrysler considers the aluminum version to be entirely new 3.6* "Pentastar" / "Phoenix" V6, see http://www.pentastars.com/ 3.7 V-6 for trucks (2002+) 3.8 New Yorker Fifth Avenue, Wrangler, minivans, etc - bored 3.3 3.9 trucks (3.9 is based on the 318) 4.0 enlarged, modified version of the 3.8 (minivans, etc) MMC 2.5 and 3.0 are related ---------------------------------- The SLANT SIX (share basic design) 2.8 (170) -- Dart, Valiant, Lancer, Barracuda (Canada), A100, D100 3.3 (198) -- Barracuda, Challenger, Dart, Valiant, Duster, Scamp 3.7 (225)-- Polara, Monaco, Coronet, Charger, Mirada, Diplomat, St. Regis, Challenger, Dart, Aspen, Fury, Belvedere, Satellite, Barracuda, Valiant, Duster, Scamp, Volare, Lancer ---------------------------------- STRAIGHT SIXES (flat head) - various sizes - ended in late 1950s for cars 215 - Australian Valiants 245 - Australian Valiants 265 - Australian Valiants 4.0 (AMC) -- Cherokee, Wagoneer, Wrangler, Grand Cherokee 4.2 (AMC) -- Wrangler Families: 215/245/265, 4.0/4.2, flat heads The Australian straight sixes was built on a basic design intended for use in American trucks. They changed from the slant six to Australian-built 215, 245, and 265 sixes in 1970. The Aussie models had hemispherical heads, so the 3-2barrel Weber version could honestly be called a Hemi Six-Pack. ---------------------------------- V-8s 4.5 (273) -- Dart, Valiant, Barracuda, Coronet, Belvedere, Satellite 4.7* -- 1999 Grand Cherokee, Charger R/T (CNG), next-gen Rams 5.2 (318) -- Polara, Monaco, Coronet, Charger, St. Regis, Magnum, Mirada, Challenger, Dart, Aspen, Fury, VIP, Belvedere, Satellite, Road Runner, Barracuda, Valiant, Scamp, Duster, Volare, Cordoba, LeBaron, Newport, New Yorker, Gran Fury, Imperial, Grand Cherokee, Grand Wagoneer, Diplomat, Demon, pickups and SUVs thru 2001. 5.6 (340) -- Charger, Challenger, Dart, Barracuda, Duster, Road Runner, Ramcharger 5.7 Hemi* (345) -- Pickups, LX cars, Grand Cherokee, Durango 5.9 (360) -- LeBaron, Newport, New Yorker, 300, Cordoba, Diplomat, Polara, Monaco, Challenger, Dart, Aspen, Fury, Gran Fury, Barracuda, Duster, St. Regis, pickups and SUVs thru 2002. (345) -- Hemi Magnum engine for trucks, next-gen large cars 5.9 (361) -- Coronet, Charger, Belvedere 5.9 (360-AMC) -- Grand Wagoneer 6.1 Hemi - SRT8 models pre 2011 6.2* -- Supercharged Hemi due around 2014-2015 6.3 (383)-- Newport, 300, Town & Country, Polara, Monaco, Coronet, Charger, Challenger, Dart, Fury, Belvedere, Satellite, Road Runner, Barracuda, Magnum 6.4* (392) Hemi - SRT8 models 2011+ 6.6 (400) -- Newport, New Yorker, Town & Country, Monaco, Fury, Road Runner, Gran Fury, Charger, maybe Cordoba, Magnum 7.0 (426, Hemi & Wedge) -- Belvedere, Road Runner, GTX, Barracuda, Challenger, Charger, Coronet, Daytona, Superbird 7.2 (440) -- Newport, New Yorker, 300, Town & Country, Imperial, Polara, Monaco, Coronet, Charger, Challenger, Fury, VIP, Belvedere, Road Runner, GTX, Barracuda, Daytona, Superbird ---------------------------------- 8.0* V-10 -- Viper, Ram trucks (two versions, fairly different) Truck version (cast iron) ended in 2002. Aluminum continues. ---------------------------------- DIESELS see http://www.allpar.com/mopar/Diesel.html 1.6 I-4: Perkins (European production cars, retrofits) 1.9 I-4: Detroit Diesel/VM engine, used in export cars 2.1 I-4: Renault, used in export Cherokee 2.5 I-4: VM engine, used in export cars, minivans, Jeeps 2.7 I-5: Mercedes engine, export Grand Cherokees 2.8 I-4: VM engine, used in export cars, minivans, Jeeps 3.0* I-4: Fiat engine, used in Ram ProMaster 3.0* V-6: VM (Grand Cherokee, Ram 1500, export cars) 3.0 V6: Mercedes, 3.1: I-5 Detroit Diesel/VM (export Jeeps) 4.0: Mitsubishi 6DR5, used 1978-? in trucks 5.9 I-6: Cummins (trucks, 1989-) 6.7* I-6: Cummins (trucks) Also: Perkins diesels in trucks and retrofits ---------------------------------- Gary Howell clarifies: ** Small blocks (except new 4.7) ** 273/318/340/360 are LA engines they look the same from the outside. LA stands for "Lightweight-casting A" [There is now an A/LA page at http://www.allpar.com/mopar/318.html] 273 cu. in. 1964-69 3.31 stroke and 3.63 bore 318 cu. in. 1968-91 3.31 stroke and 3.91 bore 340 cu. in. 1968-73 3.31 stroke and 4.04 bore 360 cu. in. 1971-91 3.58 stroke and 4.00 bore The A engines (not LA) are older small blocks and look the same on the outside to each other. The blocks are different in deck height, but share some internal components with the LA block. The cylinder heads and intake are different. 277 cu. in. 1956 3.75 bore and 3.12 stroke 301 cu. in. 1957 3.91 bore and 3.12 stroke 318 cu. in. 1957-67 3.91 bore and 3.31 stroke Many changes were made to create the Magnum engines; the heads and fuel delivery systems are the largest differences. ** Big Blocks ** There are eight different big blocks. The B blocks are short deck and the RBs are tall deck. The RBs require a wider intake manifold. [RB engine page: http://www.allpar.com/mopar/383.html] B: 350, 361, 383, 400 RB: 383, 413, 426 Wedge (not Hemi), 440 All B engine use 3.38 stroke crank with different bores, and all RB engines use 3.75 stroke crank with different bores. There were two different 383s; the RB is rare, and was created to solve limited-time production-line issues. The 350 was only produced in 1958, the first year of the B engines. *********************************************************** NEW TRANSMISSION DESIGNATIONS (Courtesy Daniel Adams) On the 1980s-2010s transmissions (e.g. 41TE): 4 amount of forward gears (from 3 to 6 at this point!) 1 the torque rating for the trans (on a 1-8 scale 1 lowest 8 strongest) T or R transaxle or rear wheel drive e or h electronic or hydraulic There are two five-speed automatics: a Chrysler-designed unit based on the 727, and a Mercedes-designed unit. 62TE six-speed automatic is similar to the four-speed car automatics and actually has seven forward speeds including a kickdown gear. Truck automatics are generally 727-based (unlike minivan autos.) Eight and nine speed automatics were engineered by ZF and will be made by Chrysler. This numbering system was changed very recently (around 2012-2013) so that the 845RE is an eight speed with 450 Nm of torque capacity - that's 8 for speeds, the next two numbers (45) for Nm of torque divided by ten, then R for rear wheel drive (T again for transaxle), and E for electronic though Chrysler has no hydraulic control transmissions now, making the "E" pointless. Hence the 928TE is a nine speed front-drive transaxle with 280 lb-ft capacity. Chrysler appears to still be using manufacturer codes for purchased transmissions, e.g. the ZF HP90 (90 standing for 900 Nm capacity). Transmission list with details on many types of transmission: http://www.allpar.com/mopar/transmissions.html To convert from Nm to lb-ft -> http://www.allpar.com/cars/conversions.php *********************************************************** CAR BODY TYPES Because the list of car body types was getting rather confusing - there are far too many models that jumped from one platform to another - we have taken this out of the FAQ and refer you instead to full, informative lists of cars by body type at: http://www.allpar.com/model/rwdbodies.html (rear drive and trucks/Jeeps) http://www.allpar.com/model/fwdbodies.html (front drive). For an example of the difficulty, the early Barracuda was a modified Valiant, hence an A-body; later it moved to a platform shared only with the Challenger (E-body). The New Yorker was a K-car, C-body, and several more...in one year sharing two different bodies (not unlike the Stratus whose sedan and coupe versions were built on totally different platforms, made by two different companies, in the same years!). The Fury moved from C to B body in the late 1970s. There are many others... cars were resized, transformed, dropped, and brought back with the same names.